Vendor Selection in China
This post is a summary of vendor selection trip to China made for a purpose of s/w outsourcing initiative for a midsized product company. The main focus of the trip was “profiling” of the vendors that made on a short list after a rather involved RFP process.
Profiling involved in-depth interviews of employees ranging from Sr. PM to Jr. QA analysts. I had a chance to interview over 60 people, and I believe that I had a chance to work with a somewhat fair sampling. I would expect that if employees were selected for interview completely randomly I would have the same professional skills ratings but English skills ratings would be substantially lower.
The table below presents a summary of my view on the software teams I’ve seen during the trip. Professional skills are rated from 0 to 10; 0 means no knowledge of the key subjects, 10 means exact or above expectations for the position. English skills are rated from 0 to 10, 0 means no knowledge, 10 means fluent (strong accent, minor grammar mistakes, etc. acceptable).
| Position | Professional Skills | English Skills | Comments |
| Account Management | 5-8 | 6-9 | I did not interview AMs per se, I had a plenty of time to observe their work though. Skills / understanding of AM practices were not at all impressive. While the hospitality was truly commendable understanding of AM activities was far from what I would expect from professional AM / sales / presales team. In particular the ability to listen and concentrate on my needs versus out of the box presentations and sales pitches was not demonstrated. |
| Project Management. | 4-6 | 5-8 | I interviewed 2 PMs, 2 were dreadful, one good, the rest were semi-decent but junior. Most of the PMs had almost no theoretical knowledge and border-line acceptable hands-on skills; only one was PMP certified, unfortunately he needed an interpreter to communicate. Real hands-on PM experience was ranging from 2 to 6 years. Most of the PM in US terms could probably be ranked somewhere between a Project Coordinator and Junior PM. |
| Business Analysis. | 3-5 | 3-7 | Unacceptable. I interviewed at least 8 of them and the only one I would possibly consider was a junior Indian girl. Most of them had moderate English skills, but still far less than you would expect from a BA. Their skills in written English were notably better but they really straggled in spoken language; understanding them was a challenge as well. Their domain expertise was not impressive even for the projects they worked on. Functional skills such as ability to gather requirements were very poor. Technical skills such as data modeling skills were practically non-existent. |
| Junior Developers (“coders”). | 3-8 | 4-8 | Developers range from very bad to pretty good. Most of them offered very poor theoretical skills and narrow and shallow practical. Need to be hand-picked, but there is a large pool to draw from. I would expect a hit ratio of 1 out of 4. I saw great deal of desire to succeed and multitude of signs of superb work ethics. |
| Senior Developers (“architects”) | 3-6 | 3-5 | Very poor, most of them at best would qualify for mid-level developers. English skills are notably worse than juniors. The more senior the person is the more difficult s/he is to understand. The only good guy I met (would rate highly in Silicon Valley) required an interpreter. |
| Technical
Leads |
5-6 | 4-7 | Mediocre. Probably not self sufficient on tasks requiring dealing with complex technical issues. They seem to be generally a combination of a mid-level developer with a junior PM. I would say on both PM and technical accounts they are a notch lower than I would expect in the USA. On the other hand I saw a very strong drive / desire to succeed which could possibly compensate to some degree for the lack of knowledge. |
| Junior QA, Black Box | 6-9 | 5-10 | Testing skills ranging from good to very good. English at pretty decent level (most of them came from English studies or had lived in English speaking countries). Most of the QA analysts I interviewed seemed to have a great personality to position match. |
| Junior QA, Automation | 4-5 | 5-7 | Very small pool, most of them were mediocre at best with very limited exposure to tools. Typical “record and play back” skill set. Most of them had a career path of black box tester to an automation engineer (no development background). |
| Senior QA, Automation |
4-5 | 3-5 | Bad. I saw only four of them though; both skills and language were below mediocre. |
| QA Lead | 7-8 | 5-8 | I saw 9 QA leads and all were OK, nothing spectacular but very focused, detailed oriented, well organized, etc. Good grasp on QA process (very specific to the company’s process though). Understanding / grasp of QA automation at very basic level. |
| General Management | 5-10 | 6-10 | Very strong business leaders with outstanding work ethics and commendable drive. Mostly ex-pats / returnees from Western countries / Hong Kong / Singapore. However some of them were not professionally strong as they seem to be able to get the jobs on the raising wave of outsourcing mainly due to their western credentials. For example one of the execs I met was a Ph.D. in theoretical physics with no prior consulting / sales / software experience, very smart guy with very little experience / exposure / understanding… |
S/W Development Outsourcing: China vs. India
A few months ago I went through a vendor selection process for a technology company in SF Bay Area. The goal was to find a vendor that would become a long-term partner / a part of a local development team. My clients were set on considering only two countries – India and China.
The size of a potential outsourcing deal was fairly small: ~15 people. That would roughly correspond to $1M on annual basis. The size of engagement was still big enough to give us a chance to pick a company from a large pull of vendors who seemed to be interested. Here are some observations based on our analysis:
Rates
In both countries we saw a plenty of companies prepared to compete on price and go very low just to get the deal. Larger / more mature companies had notably higher rates, many of them with very similar message “We are by far not the cheapest but we are the best”. Considering companies we liked the rates for India depending on position and company were roughly between $20 and $35 an hour with blended rate for our team ~$30; the rates for China were roughly between $15 and $30 an hour with blended rate for our team ~$20;
Access to Resources
Access to resources in high-tech centers of India is getting increasingly complex, finding It talent ion cities such as Bangalore is almost as complex as in San Francisco. Outsourcing companies also have to compete with subsidiaries and offshore divisions of multinational corporations such as IBM, Microsoft, Accenture, etc.
We still were surprised with how difficult and slow the sourcing process was. It seemed that finding even mainstream roles such as .NET developers or Winrunner QA guys was practically impossible.
We found that access to resources in China was not as complex. It appeared that companies in China were able to staff up for a project 3-5 times faster than India companies. In example confirmed by the references it took 2 months to build a 30 FTE team versus 9 months for the same by Indian Tier 1 InfoSys.
Resource Quality
The companies with $5M-$20M revenue range (our target based on scope of outsourcing) fall in a group of 3rd to 5th tier companies with inevitable impact on their access to resources which is exacerbated by general scarcity of IT talent. So it was not a surprise for us to see very poor quality of resources. Our average “hit rate” (number of people we would consider for “hire” vs. people presented to us by the vendors) was 1 out of 4.
Companies with the same $5M-$20M revenue range are the first/second tier companies in China with top pick in off campus hiring as well as other methods of employee sourcing. We saw that as a solid, and possibly the most important, advantage for Chinese firms. However our hit ratio was even lower than in India – 1 out of 5.5 due to serious communication / language handicap.
Concentrating only on those resources who we considered potential “hires” we saw a decent blend of theoretical and practical knowledge with some diversity in skills / background / experience in India. Our potential “hires” in China showed rather weak theoretical knowledge across the board. Their practical skills were solid yet extremely narrow; most of the “good” people we talked with were “pigeonholed”, and did not seem to mind.
Employee Turnover
Getting honest information about turnover, retention and attrition seemed practically impossible so we got the numbers from unsolicited references rather than from the vendors.
Most of the large s/w outsourcing companies in India have turnover rates exceeding 30%. Attrition is particular high in large centers such as Bangalore, Hyderabad, Mumbai, New Delhi. For small companies it is not unusual to see offshore staff turnover rates exceeding 50%.
Turnover rates in China outsourcing industry are under 25%. The companies that were selected claimed to have attrition rate about 15%. We saw low attrition rates as probably one of the greatest advantages of China over India.
Communications
There is no comparison in communication skills of consulting work force in India and China. Command of English language for majority of people we interviewed in India was far stronger than mine. In China the situation was opposite, more so the more skilled and senior the resource the lower his/her language skills.
Language in just one of many dimensions of communication. There are many skills important for bridging cultural differences and communication gaps. When it comes to dealing with USA companies Indian consultants have a huge lead on Chinese in many aspects, just to name a few:
- Body language / facial expressions – much easier to understand and follow
- Overall presentation skills
- Understanding of professional lingo
- Grasp on general rules of professional communications and office etiquette
With communications being one of the most important aspects of majority outsourcing initiatives India have a huge lead on China.
Mindset & Work Ethics
Talking with a large group of reference accounts (including unsolicited) gave us an interesting insight into mindset and work ethics of development teams in India and China. Here are a couple things that people had general agreement upon when it comes to resources from Indian vendors:
- A mindset of typical outsourcing company is oriented towards revenue / profit and is focusing employees towards “billing hours” rather than customer satisfaction or success of the project.
- High turnover rates and general acceptance of job hopping have devastating impact on resource’s attitude and work ethics.
- Majority of consultants have over-inflated expectations in terms of their seniority, type of work they should be doing, and a speed of promotion.
We heard much more favorable assessment of mind set and work ethics for Chinese workforce:
- With aggressive market share oriented drive of China s/w outsourcers employees of these companies are focused on high productivity and customer satisfaction.
- Workdays of 10-12 hours are not at all unusual (note that billing is typically negotiated on monthly basis with 8 hour workdays).
- There is a strong prevalence of team values over individual.
The workforce work ethics present one of great advantages of the outsourcing companies in China. Combined with lower levels of flexibility in job market (partially due to the country’s political and economical structure) the work ethic to some degree offsets luck of knowledge and experience.
Total Cost of Outsourcing
And finally – Total Cost of Outsourcing (TCO). TCO is the cost that accommodates for the communication overhead, lower productivity, and all other costs that are not reflected in the rate. In a large degree assessing the TCO requires substantial experimental data with a specific vendor. Based on a survey of the references during this engagement, my own experience and experience of similar companies in terms of the structure and the scope of outsourcing we came up with interesting numbers presented below. The numbers are presented as a percentage of savings / losses over typical full time employee rates:
| Project Type | India | China |
| Small R&D projects | Loss 25 – 45% | Loss 30 – 70% |
| Large R&D projects | Loss 10 – 15% | Loss 10 – 15% |
| Small mainstream projects | Loss 10% – Saving 10% | Loss 15% – Saving 15% |
| Large mainstream projects | Savings 10 – 30% | Savings 15 – 45% |
| Large QA (black box) projects | Savings 15 – 30% | Savings 25 – 50% |
Pros and Cons of doing business in China
From 30,000’ view Pros and Cons of giving your outsourcing business to China could be summarized as
Pros
- Comparatively low rates
- Low attrition rates
- Large pool of talent in many areas
- Superb work ethics of the workforce
- Well organized / highly disciplined organizations
- Staff’s desire to succeed (learning and becoming stronger professional rather than pure career move)
- Flexibility of the contract arrangements
Cons
- Poor English skills
- Weak grasp on western communications style, wide cultural gap
- Poor theoretical knowledge in many key areas
- Weak technical skills in comparison to the mainstream Silicon Valley resources
- Limited access to resources in several key areas (e.g. business analysis, architecture)
For most outsourcing initiatives that I managed and consulted on Cons outweighed the Pros. Yet I hope that sooner or later I find the right project and a team in China to match, more so I believe that the balance of Pros and Cons is changing as we speak; in particular
- Poor English skills – Chinese government and outsourcing companies are making very significant investments in English training.
- Weak grasp on western communications style, wide cultural gap – A large number of expatriates returning to China with their families after living in the USA and other countries is reshaping culture of Chinese outsourcing.
- Poor theoretical knowledge in many key areas – I am not seeing notable changes there; possibly due to the fact that majority of service buyers are not concerned with that issue.
- Weak technical skills in comparison to the mainstream Silicon Valley resources – Using an old joke as a metaphor – Chinese vendors do not need to outrun Silicon Valley they just need to outrun Indian vendors.
- Limited access to resources in several key areas (e.g. business analysis, architecture) – Influx of expatriates and attention to the issue should eventually take care of it.
| Of course as Cons are being addressed China may lose some of its competitive advantage in Pros category – attrition rates, cost, etc. That remains to be seen.
I always thought that China was destined to win, and if I ever had any doubts they were eliminated after my trip to Shenzhen. When you see what a combination of strong hand of the government and grass root entrepreneurship can do to transform a small fishing village into a megapolis in just 35 years you start to believe that there is nothing that China can not achieve. |
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Not yet ready for China
I love travel and visit new places, even if that’s on a business trip. Needless to say that living “5 to 7” lifestyle (by 5 am Monday you are on a plane to the client and ~7 pm on Friday are back on your way home) grows old quickly, but my engineering leadership role delivers travel in just the right amount. So I was quite excited when I got a chance to go to China to meet with a few promising offshore outsourcing companies. Impressed by meetings with vendors’ execs I was looking forward to starting with one of their teams in China.
Jumping ahead, I have to tell you that out of my top three impressions of China one was far above the expectations, one was at par, and one was way below. The first one was food – sorry Chef Chu, Dragon Well, and Yank Sing – there is no better place for Chinese food than China. The impression that was exactly at par with my expectations was my prospect resources’ command of English – it was dreadful. That was not a big deal for me though – English is a second language and work in progress for me as well, plus quoting Clarence Darrow, “Even if you do learn to speak correct English, whom are you going to speak it to?”. The thing that fall way below my expectations and to large degree ruined the trip was technical skills of engineers I saw.
Having spent the last 10 years of my life in Silicon Valley I’ve been conditioned to be surrounded by people much smarter than I. A great majority of them came from Asia. So I was expecting to see people like Bhaskar H, John B, Mark Dao, Shao Fang, Harshal Deo, Michelle Sue, Ashish Mangla… I was expecting maybe not the same level of intelligence, grasp on technology, and knowledge of foundations but at least somewhat close. Instead, my vendors paraded in front of me dozens of engineers who could not explain what a polymorphism is, project managers who did not know how to use MS Project, business analysts with nothing but a desire to be one. A few days into my interview process going through at rate of ~20 30-min interviews per day I met only one decent PM who did not speak English at all, one good yet quite junior business analyst (she was an IIT grad and just moved to China with her husband), and a handful of barely acceptable engineers. My interviewing stats were:
Project Managers – 1 out of 9
Business Analysts – 1 out of 11
Senior Developers – 0 out of 6
Mid Level Developers 2 out 14
Junior Developers – 4 out of 9
QA Leads – 1 out of 4
Blackbox Testers – 4 out of 6
Automation Testers – 0 out of 7
After visiting four companies my mind was set and I switched to enjoying tours to Forbidden City, Bird’s Nest and Summer Palace; I climbed the Great Wall, took many pictures, and bought a bunch of souvenirs. I knew that would be a while before I see China again.
Having spent some time thinking through the reasons behind my failure to find the vendor I could probably attest to those commonly known:
- China is relatively new to the IT outsourcing, in particular for US projects. There is a great deal of skills, experience and understanding that has not yet been built up.
- Language is a natural and serious obstacle which China outsourcing companies need to invest a great deal.
- Chinese outsourcers need to learn how to deal with a large variety of cultural differences to successfully compete (and not only on cost). I believe that they need to find their own style. While a lot could be taken from success of Indian vendors, just “cut and paste” would not work.
On my trip to China I also discovered a few things that I had not heard of before:
- In Chinese education system getting an English major ranks bottom low vs. engineering or CS degrees. Inevitably it attracts the least talented students. However, in a race to address language handicap outsourcing companies recruit English major students for key development positions – project managers, business analysts, etc. No wonder none ob the BA I interviewed heard of UML…
- While checking out offices of many outsourcing companies I noticed one thing in common: developers’ desks were perfectly clean – not a single book anywhere. I guess one of the reasons is in lack of relevant literature in native tongue. Reading O’Reilly in English is an uphill battle for many of engineers.
- Most of the engineers I talked with gained all their knowledge on the projects they worked on, which is a great way to learn when it is one of the methods, not the only. Result is extremely narrow scope of knowledge / expertise.
So I guess I am not ready to send my work to China yet, while I really do want to. Why? That would be a great topic for another post.
About
The price one pays for pursuing any profession or calling is an intimate knowledge of its ugly side. [James Baldwin]
In IT outsourcing one does not need to go too far to get ultimately familiar with its ugly side. However, despite all disappointments and failures I honestly believe in offshore capacity and its positive impact on the industry. I’ve seen enough success stories to continue using offshore resources myself and recommend it to others. Offshore outsourcing is one of most powerful weapons in technical leaders arsenal. And like any other powerful weapon it requires careful handling and great deal of knowledge in its use and application. Ugly enough even slight mistakes in its utilization could cost companies enormous pain and expense and technical leaders their reputation and career.
The goal of this blog is to bring to everyone involved in offshore outsourcing my 5 T’s – Thoughts, Tools, Tips, Tricks, and Traps of outsourcing. I hope you find it helpful.
